Posts by Cold Steel

23

Have YOU Had a SUPERNATURAL Experience?

by Cold Steel in

regardless of your religious background, how many of you have had any type of a paranormal or supernatural experience, good or bad?.

i've known a number of people who have tried ouija boards.

most had just creepy feelings, but one had a nasty experience.

Cold Steel

He's black with a natural.

What d'ya mean "he," pale face?

23

Have YOU Had a SUPERNATURAL Experience?

by Cold Steel in

regardless of your religious background, how many of you have had any type of a paranormal or supernatural experience, good or bad?.

i've known a number of people who have tried ouija boards.

most had just creepy feelings, but one had a nasty experience.

There are people who don't believe who become believers, but why? And some who are believers for some reason stop. The human mind is incredibly susceptible to suggestion, and people like Derren Brown and the Amazing Kreskin have convinced many that they are psychics. I love the series, The Mentalist, and as those of you who watch the show know, Patrick Jane, a guy who knows how to manipulate and read people, is the biggest cynic in the show. Conversely, the most open minded person in the show is Red John, Jane's nemesis and a serial killer who murdered Jane's wife and young daughter. One of the threads in the show is how Red John wants Patrick to join him, and he, unlike most serial killers, has a vast and varied following.

Kreskin once had a little chat with his audience, then he took them outside to look at the night sky. As he spoke, he used a "key" word and, incredibly, the people began seeing flying saucers. And they were so convinced that what they were looking at was real, than one guy took off and was trying to flag down a cop. Kreskin asked these people to describe what they were seeing, and some saw green UFOs, some red, others blue and orange. (You can get many of Kreskin's best episodes for ten bucks from Amazon.com. For the price it's a steal.) He made people think their chairs were red hot, while others couldn't get up. And yet he admits that he has no magic or psychic powers. All he does is manipulate people by suggestion, and some of his critics complain that he a little too slow to admit that he has no psychic powers. He frequently leaves people wondering.

How much religion is the result of suggestion I don't know. I find it amazing how easy it is for some Muslims to kill members of their own family and friends over a religion they've spent little time thinking about. When people are raised in a superstitious religion that discourages education and fears demons in the dark and steers people away from the scriptures to articles about the scriptures. Members believe that people "sleep" when they die , even though there's substantial evidence that first century Christians believed no such doctrine. So I'm a big believer in James 1:5.

16

JW,s are told to investigate this site or similar sites to overcome objections.

by jam in

how many would remain as jw,s in fact how many would continue to.

believe in god?

i estimate 75% would leave the cult and.

Cold Steel

It took me a good 6 months as an apologist for things to finally sink in. I would come to this and other sites to strengthen my faith. I think it depends on a few factors, - stubbornness is one I had to over come to wake up.

Well, it's never a good idea to read one's critics if you want to maintain one's beliefs.

Jesus talked about planting faith in good soil for it to grow. If one sows doubt, one may very well reap disbelief. That doesn't mean one should close one's eyes to critics; but there are problems with all religions, including atheism. I had a professor who was an atheist, and he intellectually abused Christians and Jews. And he convinced a few evangelicals to abandon their beliefs. He had us read Holy Blood, Holy Grail and The Myth of Sisyphus by Albert Camus. (He didn't tell us that Camus renounced his atheism shortly before his death and even contemplated becoming a Catholic priest.)

Even though JWs can accept that their religion is false, many have it drilled into their heads that if the WTBTS isn't true, then nothing is. So they abandon all religion, which is regrettable. It's best to start out with a clean sheet of paper and putting all the BAD doctrine that the JWs teach behind you. If you study the various prophecies without any help from the Governing Body and the Watchtower editors, you'll find that a whole new world opens up, and you'll be amazed at how accurate the prophecies are, and how bad the scriptural exegesis the JWs teach is.

23

Have YOU Had a SUPERNATURAL Experience?

by Cold Steel in

regardless of your religious background, how many of you have had any type of a paranormal or supernatural experience, good or bad?.

i've known a number of people who have tried ouija boards.

most had just creepy feelings, but one had a nasty experience.

Cold Steel

Regardless of your religious background, how many of you have had any type of a paranormal or supernatural experience, good or bad?

I've known a number of people who have tried Ouija boards. Most had just creepy feelings, but one had a nasty experience. Mark had always lived in a house that wasn't quite right. There were apparitions of people (one who sat in a small study and wore glasses). And there were footsteps and lights that appeared to be caused by a car backing out of the driveway...only there weren't any cars, nor were there shadows when you held your hand up to see where it was coming from. Mark's mother fell on the stairs one day while carrying a load of laundry. She turned, thinking it was her husband, but alas, no one was there.

Mark's experience with a Ouija came when a French foreign exchange student saw the man in the study. When he got to the dinner table, he seemed to count the places that were set. When he asked if the man in the study was going to be joining them, Mark's family told him it was just an apparition. The student went back to check and returned white as a sheet. A few days later he produced the Ouija board and a small group of Mark's friends and the student attempted to use it. As they were engaged in it, Mark said, he suddenly felt very light headed. Then he felt as though he were falling backward. When he came to, the table was turned on its sides, the chairs toppled and his face hurt.

According to his friends, he leapt up, began to scream obscenities and turned the table over. The others tried to restrain him, but he lit into them and one of his friends hit him in the jaw and then shoved him in the chest, knocking him down. He tried to get up twice, but was pushed back down by the others. Then whatever it was was gone. Mark never used a board after that, but he still had paranormal experiences in the house. After he got back from school, he came in one night from his job delivering pizzas. He found his brother in an agitated state and carrying their dad's .38-caliber revolver. According to his brother, he heard someone running around upstairs and thought it was Mark. The noise continued and Mark's brother went upstairs and, to his amazement, no one was there. But he felt the hair standing up on his neck, so he got his dad's revolver and went downstairs. While he was telling Mark about this, they suddenly heard someone run across the upstairs hallway and then there was a loud crashing sound, as though someone had overturned a dresser. They felt a coldness around them, and at some point they decided to stay put. About a half hour later their dad got there. Telling him the story, they went upstairs and looked around, but there was no overturned dresser or any piece of furniture out of place. Mark's dad took the gun back, but didn't get after the teenager. They were all a little spooked.

This was in Atchison, Kansas. When Mark moved into this big old house, his junior high school teacher told him one of her students had lived in that house. His name was George Dygle, or Digal, and he spent much of his time in the attic, where he played and read. He was a solitary person, the teacher said, and he committed suicide in the attic...by hanging. It sounds like something out of a bad movie, but Mark said he found knife marks in the wood where someone wrote, "G.D." in a number of places. He died a young teenager with no friends. And even though the apparition in the study was an older man with glasses, they nicknamed him "George."

I found Mark to be a credible guy, and the fact that the rest of his family shared some of his experiences added to that credibility. He's dead now, so it's possible he now knows what it's all about. He got more religious as he got older, and he refused to have anything to do with the paranormal world. He told me he just viewed it as a question mark. He couldn't explain why an "evil" spirit would catch his mother on the stairs, but didn't know why a good spirit would still be roaming around an old house.

Any other stories??

I understand the Jehovah's Witnesses have a lot of stock stories. What do you think of the paranormal? Are you more or less inclined to believe in it if you are a former JW?

81

Would Elders You Knew Have Ordered Stonings If They Could Have?

by Cold Steel in

for those of you who used to be jws, or who are active, if the society was in charge of the earth, how many people do you think you would have seen stoned during your lifetimes?

i realize some elders can be zealous about their work, but if they'd actually had administrative authority to have kh members stoned to death, how many elders did you know who would have been zealous enough to really order them?.

did you know any elders who would have ordered stonings, even if the condemned people had been willing to repent?.

Cold Steel

The JW have a very distorted view on life. They thrive with expectation of billions to be killed, just to be in paradise themselves. They like the stories about the Egyptians killed in the Red Sea or how Samson killed the Philistines and read them to their kids. They put a mass-murderer (David) as an example.

David only was charged with the murder of Uriah. He was not regarded as a “mass murderer” by the Lord as far as I know.

My own religion has some grisly prophecies about the future, but the prophecies have always been couched in an understanding that no matter how wicked a people are, when you see to what extent they are suffering, your hearts will go out to them. Says one: “For after your testimony cometh the testimony of earthquakes, that shall cause groanings in the midst of her, and men shall fall upon the ground and shall not be able to stand. And also cometh the testimony of the voice of thunderings, and the voice of lightnings, and the voice of tempests, and the voice of the waves of the sea heaving themselves beyond their bounds. And all things shall be in commotion; and surely, men's hearts shall fail them; for fear shall come upon all people.”

When that great tsunami hit in 2004, no one in my faith celebrated the loss of life or property. The same thing with the earthquakes and tsunamis in Japan, and with Hurricanes Andrew, Katrina, Sandy and others, though many have seen the stark increase in natural disasters as fulfillment of scripture. And we’re quick to send relief to such areas when possible.

The Muslim faith and the Jehovah’s Witnesses have always looked at the suffering of unbelievers with a certain amount of glee and self-righteousness. Muslims see the afterlife as being men being serviced by beautiful women while having a view of hellfire, so they can look down and see the suffering and pain of the infidels and give glory to God. And the Jehovah's Witnesses believe that cleaning up the bodies of the wicked will be one of the chores they’ll do before getting down to an eternity of picnics and family reunions. The Westminister Baptist Church and other whackos also look forward to death and destruction.

The trouble with a "Theocracy" is that they all think that this is what they have got - they and nobody else. Once convinced of that, it is then just a short step to being able to justify such atrocities as stoning to death, burning at the stake and similar.

I hope not, though hearing about the anger expressed by some authorities I wonder how much longer the Jehovah's Witnesses can last before people get tired of waiting. According to prophecy, so many things remain to happen that I believe it will be years before the return of Jesus. If we were living in the 25th Century, I would find it tough to remain a Christian. I believe by then we'll be well into the Millennium, but if we get there and Jesus hasn't come, I would have to rethink my eschatology! The JWs have lost so much credibility that they've got precious little left. But for the rest of Christianity, we've got quite a while to go before the scriptures become a dead letter.

81

Would Elders You Knew Have Ordered Stonings If They Could Have?

by Cold Steel in

for those of you who used to be jws, or who are active, if the society was in charge of the earth, how many people do you think you would have seen stoned during your lifetimes?

i realize some elders can be zealous about their work, but if they'd actually had administrative authority to have kh members stoned to death, how many elders did you know who would have been zealous enough to really order them?.

did you know any elders who would have ordered stonings, even if the condemned people had been willing to repent?.

Cold Steel

“Good people will do good things, and bad people will carry out bad things. However, if you want to get good people to do bad things, just introduce the G.O.D. word into the equation!”

But what if a society that really is a theocracy such as the one led by Moses, and subsequently passed on to Joshua? The Jehovah's Witnesses admittedly have no revelation or inspired writings that reach scripture status. When the Lord took people in death, such as Nadab and Abihu (Leviticus 10), Achan (Joshua 7), Ananias and Sapphira (Acts 5) and others, there was always a prophet involved who used the gift of discernment in the judgment of the people. Actually, when there’s an absence of GOD and his inspiration does the risk of unjustified capital punishment become an issue. Recall also the case of the woman accused of adultery, whom Jesus saved by telling her to go her way, but to sin no more.

One of the most blatant examples of the great apostasy that showed that Christ’s ancient church had fled into the wilderness was the Catholic church’s use of bizarre, grotesque and appallingly cruel instruments of torture. While the Lord had authorized whipping under the Law of Moses, the instant blood was drawn, the whipping had to stop, regardless of what the count was he had been sentenced to. During the Inquisition, the drawing of blood was a sign the torturers were just getting started.

This story is a confirmed fact: During one official closed meeting, [an] elder said seriously: “...yes, and we did not kill enough of you...,” almost shaking with anger. With high probability the shaking would have caused the first stone to miss.

I’ve gone to a number of churches over the years and attended meetings of many sects, but I never saw any anger displayed. It makes me wonder what kind of a meeting this was and who his anger was directed at?

81

Would Elders You Knew Have Ordered Stonings If They Could Have?

by Cold Steel in

for those of you who used to be jws, or who are active, if the society was in charge of the earth, how many people do you think you would have seen stoned during your lifetimes?

i realize some elders can be zealous about their work, but if they'd actually had administrative authority to have kh members stoned to death, how many elders did you know who would have been zealous enough to really order them?.

did you know any elders who would have ordered stonings, even if the condemned people had been willing to repent?.

Cold Steel

For those of you who used to be JWs, or who are active, if the Society was in charge of the earth, how many people do you think you would have seen stoned during your lifetimes? I realize some elders can be zealous about their work, but if they'd actually had administrative authority to have KH members stoned to death, how many elders did you know who would have been zealous enough to really order them?

Did you know any elders who would have ordered stonings, even if the condemned people had been willing to repent?

5

What if there are sinners in paradise?

by goddidit in

disclaimer: i have never been a jw and don't believe in any gods.. .

i've always wondered what the jw line on this would be.

i'm sure sure if it's an original thought but i don't remember reading anything about it.. it starts with the assumption that people in the future paradise earth are exactly as perfect as adam & eve before the fall.. so, what if one of these future people "sins"?

Cold Steel

What makes you think that just because there are no sinners in the new paradise that it will ever remain so?? Were Adam and Eve "sinners" when they were placed in the garden? Was Lucifer a sinner he was an archangel? No, they later became sinners by disobeying God. Since everyone will still have their own free agency, they will be free to sin should they desire. The question is, what will keep them from desiring to sin?

5

What if there are sinners in paradise?

by goddidit in

disclaimer: i have never been a jw and don't believe in any gods.. .

i've always wondered what the jw line on this would be.

i'm sure sure if it's an original thought but i don't remember reading anything about it.. it starts with the assumption that people in the future paradise earth are exactly as perfect as adam & eve before the fall.. so, what if one of these future people "sins"?

Cold Steel

The answer is rather simple, actually. You talk to the person like a brother. If he continues to sin, you report him to the elders. The elders, with love and compassion, seek him out and talk to him...to let him know he's loved and appreciated. If he repents well and good. If he sins again, then you take him to a quarry and smash his head open with a rock!

Seriously, in the theology I embrace, Adam and Eve were placed in the garden setting with the sole intention of sinning. Why else would one take an innocent and perfect couple, introduce them into an environment with an intelligent, lying, malicious being such as Satan, and tell them there's only one sin they can commit and the penalty is death? These lovely people didn't even know what lying was, nor would they understand why anyone would do it.

God, knowing this would happen, called a great premortal conference and the Plan was introduced. But if our first parents were to sin, they would then need a redeemer and a mediator (since God cannot look upon sin with the least degree of allowance). And though he walked and talked with Adam and Eve, once they sinned, their bodies underwent a change and they became subject to death and old age and he could no longer communicate with them directly. I believe we were all there at the premortal conference and it was there that the great prophets of the earth were chosen and foreordained (see Jeremiah 1:5), and it was there where the Messiah was chosen and empowered. God, knowing that once Adam and Eve would sin, realized that they and their posterity would need a redeemer and mediator. Thus, once the deed was done, the great Mediator, Jehovah, became mankind’s Lord and Savior.

So why would all this be necessary? Because previous to mortality, we all existed as spirits and, to progress further, we needed physical bodies. But though the bodies Adam and Eve possessed were technically perfect, they lacked the ability to contain and channel large amounts of energy (glory), as well as house limitless intellects. For that we needed to fall and then be redeemed by a sinless and perfect God. For reasons we don’t yet know, we will have the potential of being resurrected with the power and glory of our Mediator. After his resurrection, as you know, he had a physical body capable of moving through walls and ceilings, and he had the power to ascend to Heaven and virtually traverse the Cosmos at will. Thus, John writes:

Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it doth not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that, when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is. (1 John 3:2)

Now add to that Jehovah’s relationship to the Father:

Who being the brightness of [the Father’s] glory, and the express image of his person, and upholding all things by the word of his power, when he had by himself purged our sins, sat down on the right hand of the Majesty on high: Being made so much better than the angels, as he hath by inheritance obtained a more excellent name than they. (Hebrews 1:3-4)

And finally:

The Spirit itself beareth witness with our spirit, that we are the children of God: And if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ. (Romans 8:16-18)

From these scriptures we can deduce:

We are the sons and daughters of God
Jesus is in the “express image” of the Father
Not only does Jesus resemble the Father, he has the same capacity for “brightness” and “glory”
If we are children of God, we’re also heirs, and joint-heirs with Christ, inheriting all that the Father has
Once resurrected, the righteous are “so much better than the angels.”

Now as the sons and daughters of God, we have the capability, or potential, of greatly exceeding the power and intelligence of angels. The Orthodox Christians have this saying: “God became as man so man can become as God.”

Thus, Adam and Eve, as spirits, were given physical bodies that are perfect within their limitations. Through the fall and the redemption, they and their posterity not only become subject to death, they are judged by accepting Jesus as the Savior and Redeemer of this world, and by dedicating themselves to the service as others. Only by successfully navigating mortality can man develop the necessary physical, mental, emotional and spiritual skill sets required for a future administrator in God’s Kingdom; and only by gaining the same sort of glorious physical body Jesus gained, through the resurrection, will he be able to harness vast amounts of power needed to aid in the creation process on other worlds.

Bottom line: Scripture states that Jesus is in the express image and glory as his Father, and that we are to be in the express image and glory as the Son. The Son inherits all that the Father has, and we have the potential to be in his express image and glory. The Jehovah's Witnesses believe we go through all of this just to recapture status quo.

That’s a bit narrow, in my view; however, we shall see!

39

Does JESUS Have Wings?

by Cold Steel in

the jehovah's witnesses believe jesus is an angel.

they also apparently believe that angels have wings.

jesus was a spirit being before he was born, we're told, and he was resurrected as a spirit (even though jesus insisted he wasn't a spirit), then does he still have his [ring bell] wings?

Cold Steel

The fact that there is a Tree of Life in the new earth suggests that, for eternity, all the inhabitants of earth will have access to the tree of life.

The reason the Lord placed a cherub to guard the Tree of Life was to keep Adam and Eve from partaking of it, and thus living forever in their sins in a fallen state. Once they had tasted of the forbidden fruit, their bodies and their natures became carnal, sinful and devilish. The scriptures state: " And the Lord God said, Behold, the man is become as one of us, to know good and evil: and now, lest he put forth his hand, and take also of the tree of life, and eat, and live for ever." (Genesis 3:22-23)

According to God's plan, man was destined to eat the forbidden fruit and to be redeemed through the shedding of blood to gain perfection. And because of Jesus' sacrifice for sin, men can be resurrected to bodies of glory. In other words, even though Jesus was resurrected with a body of flesh and bone (not blood), he was able to pass through walls and ceilings and ascend to Heaven. Adam and Eve couldn't do that. Jesus also is capable of traveling to anywhere throughout the cosmos and appearing in brilliant glory that would cause unprotected mortals to perish in flames if it weren't withheld. John writes: " Beloved, now are we the sons of God, and it does not yet appear what we shall be: but we know that when he shall appear, we shall be like him; for we shall see him as he is." (1 John 3:2). Many JWs think they would be happy as beings without glory living forever in a garden, but they would soon tire of it. So God's placing the cherub to guard the tree of life wasn't being unforgiving on his part, but merciful.